From the stage to startups—Lorenzo Thione knows how to tell a story

Mikey Mioduski: back to Presentation Thinking, aka Pitching Ain't Easy, aka the Storyteller Study Club. I'm joined here today by my co host, Molly Gagan, narrative strategist at Ghost Ranch Communications. Molly, we've got an exciting guest today, don't we?

Molly Geoghegan: Yes, another special guest. They're always special, but Lorenzo Teode, entrepreneur, co founder of Gangel's, and a lot of the other titles of things I'm going to have him tell us about, but This is a connection that we made just via cold email and Lorenzo.

Welcome. Thank you for joining the cast.

Lorenzo Thione: Thanks guys. Pleasure to be here.

Molly Geoghegan: We're always happy when someone is able [00:01:00] to make a connection online and you're Chicago local now, which we, which we love and lots of cool projects we want to hear about and yeah, thanks for saying yes.

Lorenzo Thione: Yes, absolutely. I don't know if I can, I can probably call myself local still, but it's

Molly Geoghegan: been

Lorenzo Thione: a one year, one year.

I just, just my first year anniversary in Chicago. Love it.

Molly Geoghegan: That's awesome. Congratulations. And you moved from, where did you move from?

Lorenzo Thione: I was 12 years in New York.

Molly Geoghegan: Okay. Gotcha. A

Lorenzo Thione: lot of people, when I say that, I was like, why did you move? I was like, Because that was 12 years in New York.

Molly Geoghegan: Yeah, yeah. So fair.

Mikey Mioduski: And Molly, correct me if I'm wrong, is Lorenzo our first Tony Award winning guest?

Molly Geoghegan: Mm hmm. I was gonna say. Alright, we're gonna have to get into

Mikey Mioduski: that. You're gonna have to stay to learn more about that. Because Lorenzo, as Molly said, you're many things. And not only an investor, an entrepreneur. But yeah, you've got a background in theater.

So we're, we're storytellers here on the podcast. We're people who want to become better [00:02:00] presenters. And, uh, knowing that you've probably done a whole lot of pitching, you've, you've been pitched as a, as a VC as well. Uh, we'd love to just dig in and hear like all your takes on that stuff, but maybe first can you just give us your elevator pitch?

Like, who are you? How'd you get to where you're at? If you want to go the long route or the short route, feel free.

Lorenzo Thione: Yeah. Grew up in Italy with a number of different passions as I was growing up, uh, many of which wasn't necessarily super obvious to kind of see where the, the, they would lead or what the paths would be.

Um, definitely a passion for storytelling kind of emerged very early on, really unsure of how I would harness that into anything. But, uh, at some point I wanted to be a filmmaker, a director, didn't really have a much of a, an eye for the theater at the time, but you know, I, I guess I, I attended plays and in the theater, but really grew up in the first generation that learned what the internet was, uh, and kind of got, you know, Really [00:03:00] into software engineering and computers moved from Italy, where I grew up to Austin, Texas, uh, where I went to school and university of Texas and where I got the first kind of a sign that one of my passions, which had always been to Language and, um, sort of the formal study of languages.

I've always spoken multiple languages and really loved it. Almost like a construction puzzle and where it connected with software engineering at the very beginning of, you know, sort of this wave of. AI that still wasn't being called AI because it was still a bad word at the time, but was, uh, going by the name of natural language processing or computational linguistics and, uh, ended up making that the focus of my studies.

Moved to San Francisco after graduating where I was a research scientist at Xerox PARC, uh, for a few years before turning the projects that I was working on into a company. I co founded, uh, Called PowerSat, which was 2003. So [00:04:00] before most of the modern era of AI was still kind of really being hatched. We were one of the very first companies, if not the first company to really try and bring AI and natural language into web search, competing with the likes of Google and Yahoo, uh, built an awesome team, sold the business after a few years to Microsoft and became some of the early foundational technology for Bing.

Awesome. Which kind of led to. A bunch of other things. And we can go into those, but multiple startups, multiple theatrical productions and shows, and then sort of a passion for advocacy that turned from the founding of start out an organization that supports LGBTQ entrepreneurs to the founding of Gangels, which turned into today, one of the largest, most active venture investors supporting diversity and participation for all underrepresented minorities in the venture capital ecosystem.

Molly Geoghegan: Oh, oh my God snaps. We loved it. Yeah, what's the tell us Lorenzo? What's the short version? Do you have family still back in Italy? [00:05:00]

Lorenzo Thione: I do. I have my mom and my brother still live there.

Molly Geoghegan: Very good. Do you? Do you have a shorter spiel for explaining to them what your job entails? Um, yeah, I mean,

Lorenzo Thione: when I meet people, which is really interesting, I meet people and people ask me, um, what do I do?

Or even worse when like, Oh, I think I met you before. When do I know you from? And then I'm like really puzzled because I could have met them from completely separate, um, social works that are part of my life. And, um, so I usually tell them like, so I do two things. I invest and work with startups and I also write and produce for the theater and people are like, what?

Like how, how did those two things go together? And it's been a constant throughout my life as I was transitioning from one to the other and then kind of navigating the path of maintaining a role in both. People seemed to be very confused and puzzled by, uh, you know, how, you know, I think people make [00:06:00] very easy distinctions of STEM as being something very analytical and, you know, left brained.

I guess maybe right brain. I forgot which one is which, um, and you know, theater and arts to be the opposite, right? And so these things not necessarily going together. And when I. Sort of go into the discussion of how and why I have a passion for both it kind of makes perfect sense to me because really what the throughout line, you know, that connects all of these things is the power of stories to really change the world, um, either because You inspire people to join you on a quest to change the world itself through an innovative company or technology.

And you have to tell a lot of stories in order to get people to give you money or their time to go on what otherwise seems like a pretty improbable, if not impossible quest. As well as to tell stories because you want to move and [00:07:00] inspire and educate an audience to teach and learn more about the human condition and maybe bring people, uh, just a little bit closer to each other and, and, you know, bringing more empathy to the world, which I think is a, is a great thing, or because you want to elevate stories of the ones who make it, who achieve great things, who may not look like most of the other people who have been achieving for the longest of time.

And I always joke. It's not a joke. I basically remarked that, you know, the power of visibility and representation is probably the single most powerful agent for change. Because when people have the ability and the talent, but they don't have the knowledge that something is possible for them. And they actually think it is impossible for them because they have never seen Or heard of anyone who looks like them or who has the same life experience as them to have achieved the kind of dreams that they have.

That's when people kind of don't They don't do anything [00:08:00] because they don't think it's possible when they see themselves reflected through the stories of others who may have had those same challenges or look like them or come from the same socioeconomic background and have achieved and then they know it's possible.

I don't know if you know who Sir Bannister was, but it was the first. Person to ever run the three minute mile. I think three minutes, six minutes, three minutes, three minutes. I can't remember, but it was considered impossible for the human body to actually do that. And when he did it within a year, six other people had done the same thing.

And it's just the idea of like knowing something is possible, completely changes the dynamic of whether or not people actually take it upon themselves to actually do.

Molly Geoghegan: Yeah.

Lorenzo Thione: Yeah.

Molly Geoghegan: Beautiful. Yeah, you can't be what you can't see. Yeah, story has. I mean, that's very validating to hear Mikey. We've had, I mean, certainly in this Study of our presentation, thinking passion project and exploring storytelling [00:09:00] and, uh, the intersection of business presentations, startup ventures and product marketing, you know, all these different things.

It's not just the niche, like everyone has what we've heard recently described as a squiggly background, and that actually contributes to whatever they're doing in their day to day, even if it is, as you said, like stem or science engineering is considered. So. Left brain, right brain. And it really like you need the store stories involved in all of that.

And there's a creative element involved in all of that. And in fact, many venture folks that we've had on the podcast say, if you want to get better at pitching, take an improv class. So that's, that's an interesting. Yeah. Take it

Lorenzo Thione: in class or take a storytelling seminar, like a writing seminar.

Molly Geoghegan: Yeah, absolutely.

Oh, that's, that's so cool. And what about, will you take us back to that, that moment when you, yeah, you first starting you're in that first, like, as you said, AI was hatching. You were in San Francisco and you're starting power set. What was it like being an entrepreneur at that time and like the pitching and [00:10:00] developing slides?

Yeah. What was your role there? What was, what was your day to day?

Lorenzo Thione: Well, I mean, You know, I had done my fair share of slides and PowerPoint and things of that sort, just, you know, even being a researcher at Xerox PARC, you're constantly selling your work to others, right? You're constantly, the, the, the currency you have is actually presenting your work and getting people excited about the research that you're doing.

So, um, there is a certain amount of that, that. was going hand in hand with building the demos and product demos and sort of the idea of like, you know, showing your work. When I met my co founder, I was, you know, certainly pretty young and inexperienced sitting in the context of what entrepreneurship really was and founding companies and the subtleties that go along with it.

And I've always. You know, sort of just, uh, uh, taken any opportunity I've had to learn from great people around me. And, you know, I think there's a lot of people that say, when you meet someone who, you [00:11:00] know, who's smarter than you work with them, right, or, or work for them or work with them, it's, it's just what makes you grow.

So I got a chance to, you know, really dive deep. Headfirst into the world of raising money from VCs, even though I had never done it and found myself pitching and telling the story of why I was building the technology that I had built and how Barney, my co founder had found it and found me and we had teamed up to start this company.

And, um, you know, it was, uh, it was a crash course, a crash course in venture. I learned everything from The role of associates to the role of partners, to the role of, you know, uh, presenting to a full partnerships and, and what that meant and, uh, term sheets and options and, and so on. It was exhilarating and tiring and exhausting and made of rejections and of successes.

And you kind of, you know, years later, when [00:12:00] I got myself. much more schooled in the context of theater. I recognized the additional peril between a pitching and an audition. Uh, and you know, the, the kind of culture of rejection or thick skin to rejection that you have to kind of really develop and, and also take every failure as an opportunity to learn and move forward and refine and do better the next time.

Right.

Music: Yeah.

Lorenzo Thione: Also in the same way, As which there will be roles for which you are not good for, but it's still good to go in and audition because it's a skill to be able to go to, to be able to audition. Same thing. There are investors for which you are not the right fit and vice versa, but it's still good to pitch because it's good practice and getting feedback and getting better at it.

So lots of parallels between theater and venture as people might not imagine. Yeah, it's amazing. Absolutely.

Mikey Mioduski: When you were pitching. Was there a breakthrough, um, like, did you struggle at first, uh, [00:13:00] reflecting back, or are you more of a natural presenter?

Molly Geoghegan: What came first, the pitching or the, or the you on a stage moment?

Lorenzo Thione: No, the pitching came first. I, I, you know, I think I always had a little bit of a performer in me, like, when I was, a little kid, they tell me stories of me like organized full on shows with the kids on the neighborhood block. So there was never probably like a part of me that was particularly shy. And I get very excited about Talking about my work.

I've always gotten excited in a way that I think just comes across as, as, as, as true passion, as true, uh, energy. And, and that sometimes can really play to your advantage. Like it's not as much the command of the subject, uh, from a knowledge perspective that, and when I think about me analyzing pitches that I listened to as an investor, what I am Ultimately, and I don't even think [00:14:00] that I'm looking for it, but I am weak to like, you know, you basically immediately get on the same page with someone who speaks from a place of true passion.

Like they can't see themselves not solving this particular problem or doing this particular thing. And, you know, the, the narrative in Silicon Valley and, and sort of an entrepreneurship has, you know, Grown to include the tourist entrepreneur, which is the opposite, right? Someone who is almost couldn't care what they're doing.

They're more enamored with the idea of being a founder than the specifics of what problem they're trying to, uh, solve or finding our funding. And I definitely can. I think I remember, I know I've seen those, those pitches and I know that those pitches are different to they, they just hit differently when, uh, when they, when, when it comes to, to that.

So I think, you know, I never had a problem with pitching. I think that the specifics of the pitch change as you realize [00:15:00] people. Lock on to right. And if you think that it was a, but it's B, then you're next time around, you're going to lead with B or spend more time really kind of breaking apart why B matters, as opposed to what you initially thought was going to be the hook.

And, you know, it turns out, Yeah. And, and look, it also has depended widely, uh, between what I was presenting and what I was pitching right now, these days I pitch more, you know, as an investor who needs to raise from LPs, right. And so it's a different pitch, but it's still a pitch. It's still a story than it was when I was, you know, let's get into a technical demo and I can show you how cool this is, which was definitely my ML when I was 23.

Molly Geoghegan: Yeah. Especially for the pet, that power set thing with the technical. Yeah. Yeah. Wow, that's such, that's such valuable information to kind of see that evolve over the last decade or so, right?

Lorenzo Thione: Two decades, I'm telling you. Yeah,

Molly Geoghegan: yeah. I would never know. But um, what do you think that, that role, [00:16:00] people tell, people have such different ways of starting with a story with the hook, as a hook.

I know that's such a common thing for keynotes and you see it all the time in presentations. What do you see as like, is the most important? most impactful way that people could, uh, integrate story into their presentation.

Lorenzo Thione: I think there's a, there's a, there's kind of like a counterintuitive piece, at least for me.

Obviously, we all know there are templates to stories and these templates have survived, you know, the test of time, century, millennia, and they existed. They're a real thing and they At the same time, I think good writers will always be able to thread the line between structurally sound and formulaic. And there's something really important in kind of knowing how to be on the right side of that line where you are exercising the craft and you're building [00:17:00] the right building blocks, but you're not falling into the platitude of a formula.

And, um, when it comes to a pitch, it's sometimes it is obvious When it is formulaic and you're, you're basically following a template that is so narrow and so sort of, you, you, you don't have enough room for spontaneity or for personalization or for even just personability because you're kind of, okay, I have to hit this and then I have to hit this and then I have to do it with these words and this, and just that becomes hyper rehearsed.

Too polished in ways that kind of enter the realm of, of, of cliche and of formula.

Molly Geoghegan: Mikey, I've never heard it said like that, but we talk about templates all the time at Ghost Ranch for presentations. And the power of a template is really important and the power of a [00:18:00] structure of a story. Yeah, I love, I've never heard it said like that.

Structurally sound versus formulaic. That's a great thing to kind of take away from this.

Mikey Mioduski: Knowing the rules. Very helpful. So that you can break them and inject. Insert that personality or yeah, just like make it your pitch, right? Um, so you, can we ask like, on a, any given day, week, month, year, how many pitches do you now see that you're being pitched?

I think probably about 10 per day, I think. Yeah.

Lorenzo Thione: Crazy. That's so intense. Like a lot. 5 to 10 per day. Okay. Maybe, Yeah. 3 or 4 that I pay real attention to, Uh huh. And, And lots that kind of come across my desk and just don't really make it past, Sort of a, Look. Right. Yeah.

Molly Geoghegan: Yeah. Mikey, he told me, Yeah, I, Lorenzo, When we first talked, We were, You said you had seen, I'm like, How many have you seen, Like, In your lifetime?

And you were like, Thousands. And I was so, so floored by that. And so I would love to know when we've, we've gotten really like technical on the, on the cast before talking about like cover slide, you [00:19:00] know, we've done workshops on cover slide and the problem side solution slide, that kind of thing. But we'd love to hear it.

Do you think, yeah, of course there's a structure to stories, but is there kind of a formula that works for you? What gets a, what gets one to be one of those three or four that get, that hold your attention versus something you can skim past?

Lorenzo Thione: Interestingly enough, I'd like it's, there's a little bit of a, I know when I see it, which I know is not helpful, but it's kind of hard to exactly put into words when you look at a deck and, or a pitch and, and you're kind of.

feeling it. I can tell you that that when a deck is incredibly badly Organized or designed even when it's just, you know, bullet points in the kind of a basic PowerPoint template, when there's a lot of words, when there's not modern design and where modern actually does change with the times that all works [00:20:00] against it.

And partially is, you know, I need to kind of feel that the founder and the team is immersed in the same Culture where the company is going to thrive, right? And so that requires a certain amount of absorbing and adopting the standards in expression, in design, in flow, you know, that are of the moment. And, and I think that it's not by chance that you also have like a lot of decks that end up looking similarly to each other, which is not necessarily.

a disaster unless they are of the wrong similar. Like if you chose the wrong coding for the wrong boot switch for your deck, that can work against you. But ultimately I think it needs to feel for me, it needs to feel like the founders understood the world around them in the context of What other pitches index and companies, [00:21:00] what kind of style and design they adopt, uh, what kind of websites aesthetic exists, all of that is important from a structural perspective.

I always just really want clarity on the message. I just want to in the first two slide. I want to understand what the problem that is being solved is. And so many times that does not happen. Like it takes longer or it never happens that I actually understand what the pain point and the problem that is being solved is.

I know that there are businesses where that is simply more easily said and explained than in others. But ultimately, you know, it's just that it's your job that is harder to explain. It's not that it's an excuse for people not to be able to understand what it is that you're doing. And so really in one or two slides.

Tell me what it is that you're doing. The third slide, honestly, I want to know what makes you special. Who, you know, who are you and why is the uniqueness of your business? The one that should set it apart. And then you [00:22:00] can go into all of the standard pieces, whether it's a team and product, and at the very end, talk to me about who has funded your business and who is, what are you, what are you going to, yeah.

You know, need in order to get to the next to the next stage, but really clarity on what the problem being solved is and then what the solution is, is The most important thing.

Music: Yeah.

Molly Geoghegan: And are these coming to you via email, right? For the most part, but just attached in a PDF or?

Lorenzo Thione: Yeah. I mean, I would say if, if it's a cold email that doesn't include a deck, that's very difficult for me to kind of respond, but I have.

There's a skill to a cold email too. I will skim it. I will skim every email that comes through. And so I always say like less is more in a cold email. I really only want to know who you are and what problem you're tackling. I don't even know. I don't [00:23:00] really want to know the details of. where you are with your traction or like, I want to know, like, is this an interesting problem to solve?

And who are you that I can come back and ask for a meeting or for a deck or something? Honestly, if you can send a brief email that gets someone to ask for a deck you're doing right. Like that's the first thing you can do with a cold email.

Music: Yeah.

Lorenzo Thione: Having a cold email that includes a deck. Yeah. Is fine. And you can gather a good amount of information if you're sending it through doc sand or whatever.

So you can see who logged in and how long they spent on what slides and so on. But I think you're better off with a cold email to not send the deck and just. Instill enough curiosity to have them ask for one because then they'll be, you'll have a conversation at that point, you'll be in a, in a back and forth and it will be much easier to actually set up a call and get to actually pitch

Molly Geoghegan: present most of

Lorenzo Thione: the, of the pitches that I [00:24:00] receive that I pay.

much closer attention to, they typically come through a warm introduction by someone in my network who can somehow vouch for who this person is or what this company is, that sort of baseline kind of cleared. And then that makes it easy for me to either look at the deck and the pitch and respond to my contact saying, I took a look, this is not for me or to ask for a direct connection and to set up a call.

Um, and then from there, we'll, we'll set up a call. And you know, when I said, I'll probably do two to four every day. That's two to four pitches on a call that I take. And then other will be emails that I'm

Mikey Mioduski: actually reviewing. It's a lot.

Molly Geoghegan: That is a lot.

Mikey Mioduski: So if they can get you on the pitch, you said you're kind of weak to like just.

Bubbling passion. Like you can tell, like they will run through a brick wall to do this thing. And then you want clarity on like, what the hell are you doing? Like, what's the problem you're solving? Have you figured that out? What's the cool solution? [00:25:00] What should their goal be? Let's say they got you a cold email.

You said, yes, they pitch you. What's next then?

Lorenzo Thione: But that, that really depends on the specifics of the company, the round and who they're talking to. Right. Like the relationship, like I'm not a. a lead VC, right? I either will write an angel check if I'm investing my own money, or if it's, if we're investing with Gangels, we're a minority follow investor where the lead is a right there, there's a price, there's an entire, right.

And we have a process, whether it's structuring, it's just, it's a, it's a, you know, so my, my sense is that actually there's a very different and very important kind of process that is to find your lead investor. And that is You know, while I'm not it, I'm not your lead investor. I have been in the position of trying to find one, whether it's a anchor LP or lead investor for a company.

And it really comes from [00:26:00] building an ongoing relationship. And sometimes Sometimes opening that relationship with a pitch is not necessarily the smartest way to go about it. It's still fine. I mean, you know, obviously you can't build ongoing relationship with hundreds of VCs and you're going to sometimes have to pitch.

Pitch to hundreds of VCs in order to find your match. But, you know, I remember, you know, in my journey, there was a lot of coffees and a lot of meetings ahead of time before investing or pitching and kind of developing an ongoing relationship. And I think one of the things that has worked very well, even for me as an investor is I'll meet a company sometimes when.

The company is not raising money and they're not really speaking to investors, but they will, uh, have a chat. learn about you, we learn about each other, they'll put you on an update list, and you'll get a sense of like the communication pattern and the progress and so on. And you kind of develop this relationship [00:27:00] over time that puts you in a really good position to then potentially raise money.

And the same thing is true for you. Develop a relationship with the investor you might want to invest or raise money from down the road, whether it's like find who the right partner is at a firm that is specific to your area or to the kind of business model or problem that you're solving. And then, you know, if it's in a place where you travel to or you live, have a meeting in person, grab a coffee.

People are eager to meet in person more than they, you know, sometimes let let's see. And, uh, it's not that difficult. And if you're doing something that is in the area that an investor is interested in, they'll want to meet with you. They'll want to learn about what you're doing. And if they're not interested, it'll fizzle out very quickly.

But if they are, if they want to keep in touch and, you know, get to know what you're doing next and, you know, what's. the next milestones that will make it much more likely that the process [00:28:00] leads from that initial pitch to another refined pitch and more questions and a partnership meeting and a term sheet.

Molly Geoghegan: Yeah. What would you say? Like, I mean, I'm looking at the Gangels website and you guys have had like Tons of, um, amazing companies and you have 70 plus unicorns, it says in the portfolio, which is amazing. Yeah, very cool. What would you say, like, describe like what the, what's the next steps once you're like, okay, yes, this person's part of the Gangels community.

Like what stage would you recommend someone, a startup founder to be in to be like, I think I should email someone like Gangels to take a look at my pitch.

Lorenzo Thione: Yeah. I mean, honestly, the key is, do you have a lead investor and does that lead investor lend enough momentum and credibility to the company? So, you know, for example, if you gotten into Y Combinator, that's a great time for us to get, to get to know you, right?

Whether even much longer before demo day, we'd love to most. And most investor will tell you the same thing. So I'm not a unique here, but [00:29:00] it's just kind of like saying there is a certain element to kind of knowing who else is. Managing the underwriting and valuation and, and all of that, that is important for our network because we operate as a syndicate, but we do have a few funds.

I manage our AI fund. Um, I invest out of conviction on my own for, from it, but the syndicate often, you know, will invest on signal and you know, the not so great, but nonetheless reality is, uh, that there is value in momentum and, and. Visibility and profile for both investors and industry. So it's a lot easier to get blue chip VC led deal in AI right now through the syndication process than it is an angel only food and beverage company.

That's the reality. I, even though I may love the founder and the company and the product, and God knows I have investments in the space that I absolutely love all three of them. Um, [00:30:00] It's just very difficult right now to get momentum for a syndication in the latter.

Molly Geoghegan: Now that makes a lot of sense.

Mikey Mioduski: Well, we did promise we'd come back to this for those who stuck around.

So, can we talk about your theater career, Lorenzo? Like, Tony?

Molly Geoghegan: The road to the Tony. We gotta

Lorenzo Thione: hear. That scene from the producers, it was like, Tony, Tony, Tony. Yes, yes, exactly. Having a stroke! So I never really kind of, it's not something like, Oh, it was your dream and you went after it. And it was like, no, it's like everything in my life has happened as an opportunity that presented itself.

And when the excitement about it seemed high enough that the opportunity cost didn't matter, I dove in headfirst and, and, you know, took a chance at whatever it is that, that, that represented. And, you know, there's. There's a great value in living life, being able to [00:31:00] say you had no regrets and you've done everything you wanted to do and you tried it and some things went the way you wanted them and some things didn't, but you learned from them.

And what happened was that at the right time in the right place, I just was presented with this very unique opportunity to work on a project that, meant a lot for me. I grew up in Italy. I mentioned it. I immigrated in the States, arrived a handful of months before September 11 happened. And that had a huge impact on my life in ways that weren't necessarily super clear at the moment, but in one, on one side, it kind of gave me a push out of the closet, you know, because you kind of realize that life is fragile and things can change on a dime in ways that you have not a lot of control over and, you know, why living in the shadow of what you feel like you are.

And so that was, uh, one thing that was somewhat immediate. And then the other one was, it gave me this kind of really clear look at a [00:32:00] modern day, discrimination or segregation that happened all of a sudden between immigrants and non immigrants and people were like even asking any exchange student like what their visa status was or are you here and why are you staying here and what like it just felt like all of a sudden your life was being scrutinized in ways that kind of reminded you of how precarious Life really was, right?

You know, you were thinking you were building a career and relationships and family and things, but you realize that, oh, God, like, you know, something like that could change, could like the attack on the twin tower could happen again and change it all over again and could, you know, make it impossible for me to stay.

And, and it was just generalized anxiety at the time, right? Like, you know, you, you live with a lot of anxieties in life. And that was one, one additional one that kind of makes you feel like, Oh, you know, I don't know how things are going to go.

Music: And

Lorenzo Thione: after I had sold my company, I just [00:33:00] was randomly one night with a friend in a theater and I hear a voice I recognized and it ended up being the actor George Takei from Star Trek, the original Star Trek series.

We struck up conversation and he ends up telling us the story of his childhood and he and his family were taken at gunpoint from their home and imprisoned in, uh, camps after, uh, the attack on Pearl Harbor for Close to five years for no crime, right? And for the fact that they descended from the same people who had in another nation attacked the United States.

And you realize like, oh, they lost their money, their home, their family business, their freedom, their savings. And they had absolutely no role in what had happened. This incredible abuse of constitutional power that happened. And. It just spoke to me in a way that I was like, people need to know that this happened.

And, you know, George is a performer and an actor. And I was there with a friend who was a [00:34:00] composer and we started talking. It was like, how crazy would it be if someone were to write this story and put it in music and, and take it to Broadway. And in retrospect, it is absolutely crazy. It's bananas that someone that had, never worked in that industry could actually think that that was something that they could do within the realm of, you know, one lifetime.

It was nuts, but we did because we didn't know how hard really it was going to be. And we kind of put one foot in front of the other and we got, uh, George and not just George, but Leah Salonga, who's going to be back on Broadway this year, you know, from Miss Saigon to be his leading lady. And, you know, we opened in San Diego and then took it to Broadway and then to London and Tokyo and Hawaii.

And that kind of opened up and the show was not financially successful, right? In order for a show to be financially successful, you have to hit so many kind of bull's eyes that If that is your standard for why you do something, [00:35:00] then don't because, you know, chances are you're going to be devastated by it.

The way that I initially felt like I was going to be and then in retrospect to realize it's probably one of the things I'm the most proud of because I still meet people whose lives have been touched and changed by that show. It has had many a life. I think it will continue to have a life and for someone to just kind of leave a piece of their creative effort and energy and, and, and, and spirit into the American, Musical theater pantheon.

I think it's a pretty cool thing whether or not you made money. Yeah

Molly Geoghegan: Yeah, and that speaks to the power of storytelling like it doesn't it's not necessarily about like the experience from you jumping into this world It's like but that's how compelling of a story it was And, um, that's allegiance, right?

Lorenzo Thione: That's allegiance, yeah.

Molly Geoghegan: Okay, so we'll link, we'll link that in the show notes for anyone, anyone curious.

Lorenzo Thione: And then, you know, that started a whole career as a producer and creator. And as you do, like in venture, sometimes you're the founder, [00:36:00] sometimes you're the backer, and sometimes you're the board member.

And I was a co producer. on several shows, which won Tony awards, two of which were great shows. I was passionate about one is a great commercial success, which is Hadestown. The other one is that was not a great commercial success, but nonetheless, one of the things I'm the most proud of being associated with a play called the inheritance.

And then many other shows that we're not, you know, fortunate to win accolades, but still are successful commercially. Like And Juliette and others. So very proud of, of all the work done in the theater.

Mikey Mioduski: Are you working on any new ones, uh, that you're excited about right now? Yeah. Several

Lorenzo Thione: just working on an, uh, on a show I co created alongside with my collaborators, uh, called Indigo.

But that tells the story of three women connected through generations. One of which is an, uh, nonverbal autistic teenager who is really, the kind of fulcrum [00:37:00] for how her mom and her grandma all figure out ways of connecting with her and with each other, all indigo. Um, and we, uh, did a short production in Ohio last year and are headed to London for a workshop later this fall, uh, before moving on to next steps.

Two early, early, early projects in kind of the development ideation phase, another play with an adaptation of a book called The Elephant Whisperer, and then a secret project that we're moving from London to hopefully Broadway next year.

Molly Geoghegan: Wow. Okay, people will have to follow you to stay tuned. And we'll definitely, and Mikey, I think we're in the uh, Spice Cabinet segment of our, of our show.

Lorenzo, this is where we just ask you some. fun hot seat kind of questions. Yeah. As a creative person, as a fan of musicals and theater, I'm excited to ask you a few of these, um, or I threw in a few special ones, but first of all, back to the presentation piece. Do you have a favorite, like, [00:38:00] Presenter or Ted talk you've ever seen or someone that you even follow for like presentation inspiration.

Lorenzo Thione: I don't know. Presentation wise. I mean, I occasionally felt like, you know, find that Ted talks that I really like, but I don't think I've kind of gotten into the MO of like, Oh, I follow this one person or that one person.

Music: There are definitely

Lorenzo Thione: thinkers that I just really enjoy. Uh, Sam Harris being one, um, just really kind of, uh, appreciate.

a lot of his writings and a lot of, uh, the work he does on his podcast and so on. But you know, there's, I, I'm, I'm always kind of, uh, open to kind of absorbing new ideas of, of, of presenting.

Molly Geoghegan: Yeah. I love it. I mean, I would argue George Takei is a great presenter.

Lorenzo Thione: Great presenter.

Molly Geoghegan: Yeah. Um, okay. And then Hinnis, what's your favorite musical?

I know this is a hard thing for like, a theater enthusiast, but favorite musical or play?

Lorenzo Thione: Well, so my favorite play would have [00:39:00] to be The Inheritance. Okay. Yeah. Personal connection. Favorite musical. This is difficult because for me, shows end up being favorite with respect to some elements. Like my favorite score is from a musical that is going back to Broadway this year, called The Last Five Years.

Jason, Jason, Robert Browns.

Music: Yeah.

Lorenzo Thione: My favorite show to recommend to people who have never seen a Broadway show is typically the Lion King, because I feel like it's just, well, it's just kind of quintessentially everything that's right about theater, like everything from the grand staging of it, the inventiveness, the design, the costumes, the music, the story, like everything is just really.

Marvelous, right? And then one of my favorite shows kind of like to just be moved by is Hadestown.

Molly Geoghegan: Beautiful. I can't, I'm, I've seen little clips here and there, but um, you're [00:40:00] making me, I just, I have a friend that's moving to Brooklyn in the fall, so I'm like, okay, perfect, I'll keep this list so I can kind of scope what's, what's going on and what's not.

Anything showing in Chicago right now?

Lorenzo Thione: So, uh, yeah, I'm going to see Jason Robert Brown's new musical, The Midnight in the Garden of Good and Evil, in just a couple weeks. The buzz is good and I am very excited to go see it. I just saw Death Becomes Her, which was here in pre Broadway run and had it out and it's so much fun.

Awesome. Also, so many of my friends are either producing or directing. directing or involved in some way. So really terrific show. And I saw a play earlier this year that was marvelous called Purpose by the same author who just won a Tony for best play for Appropriate.

Molly Geoghegan: Oh, amazing. I'm, I'm thinking of like, I've got old bakery friends that were all in the theater circuit acting and writing.

One friend wrote a great play that's got some good reception in Chicago. I'm plugging this personally at [00:41:00] the Red Orchid Theater. I've never, I'd never been to it when I was in college in Chicago. But his name is Levi Holloway and, um, and it was like kind of a spooky take on I think like, uh, a school. I'll have to, I'll have to link it in the spice cabinet, but there's so much good stuff in Chicago.

So it's fun. It's fun to hear that you've got, uh, your connections there too, as well. Okay, Mikey, you take the next one.

Mikey Mioduski: Okay, I'm just curious, like, how are you splitting your time now with VC and with your theater initiatives? Is it kind of a 50 50 thing? Seems like you must work eight days a week.

Lorenzo Thione: No, I mean, theater is a lot of, uh, hurry up and wait kind of thing.

The work goes in fits of, like, incredible. Intensity. And then there's just nothing for months and months on end. Right. So as we get closer to the workshop in November, there'll be a good chunk of, of time that I will be spending on it. And, you know, I'll manage my commitments, uh, as needed so that I can dedicate the [00:42:00] time that I need to it.

But most of the time, there's not that much that requires my oversight. Yeah, we have shows that are running on Broadway, but there's teams that are doing the day to day, right? And I also am fortunate to have producing partners and a team with my production company that kind of manages the sort of day to day in a way that kind of, I don't have to stay on top of.

And so I spend, you know, a good 90 percent of my day to day time on Gangel's related stuff, whether it's meeting founders or meeting potential investors, LPs into our Uh, network events, uh, networking, raising and deploying for my fund. So all of that,

Mikey Mioduski: I, I am sure there's a ton of people inspired who have maybe said, Oh, I can't pursue this interest of mine or these arts because I need to stay focused on, on my business, but love that you are.

And as you alluded top of the episode, bringing those left and right brains together. And I'm sure [00:43:00] One helps inform the other and there's a lot of like exchange between the two that helps you. Oh, there's no president. Oh,

Lorenzo Thione: yeah Yeah There's a ton of like permeability between the two so that you actually inform and can learn and apply things that you've gotten in one place into another there's also the fact that ultimately theater is a business and an industry if one that is You know, still anchored in a lot of different ways from a technology standpoint into the past.

So there's ways in which I'm more technology forward thinking that comes from startups and so on can affect a positive way. Right. So there's definitely an ad. And I think that, that my, my history, my track record, even on the theater side kind of shows how we've taken some of those things in. I also say, you know, I was fortunate that I could take risks with going into something that wasn't necessarily clear if and how and when would, you know, be successful from a financial perspective because of other successes I had with [00:44:00] PowerSet.

And so sometimes, you know, it's easy to kind of look at someone and be like, Oh, You know, but it's just, there's, it's, it's, it's all managing life as a portfolio. And so kind of, uh, you know, both in terms of your time and your effort and your risk diversification sometimes is important if you can take the wins and recycle them into other places where they may turn into losses or not, but at least you've gotten, you know, you turned it square.

Molly Geoghegan: Yeah. Yeah. Looking at life as a, life's a big portfolio. I love it. Yeah.

Mikey Mioduski: All right. Molly's gonna, Molly can ask our very important, very important, one of our last questions.

Molly Geoghegan: Yeah. You've already imparted all the advice onto Presentation Thinker. So thank you for that. Um, great, great inspiration, but we'd love to ask this, you know, you have found yourself on various stages in your life.

So, if you can picture yourself walking up to the next stage to give. Yeah, maybe like a presentation, a TED Talk about your life and your experience. What would be your [00:45:00] lockout song?

Lorenzo Thione: My walkout song.

Molly Geoghegan: Yeah. It's tough.

Lorenzo Thione: It's very tough. Cause you want to be smart about this. And I like, I would need time to actually think.

Molly Geoghegan: I know we're blindsiding you. Sometimes we, I mean, yeah, sometimes people are like, Oh, I know you asked this and I've been thinking about it for weeks.

Lorenzo Thione: Cause yeah, I mean, I did not know my walk up songs would be probably Gloria, uh, is that Gloria Gaynor? I don't know. Um, no, no, it is, or maybe, I don't know.

I'm, this is about me being a bad gay, but I'm coming out.

No, it's not. She had a Broadway musical. Diana Ross? Diana Ross. Yeah, Diana Ross

Molly Geoghegan: does it. Yeah. Yeah. Oh my God. Yeah. No, I'm, I'm a big fan too. Okay. Amazing. You've already given us so much inspiration and advice and I, I really appreciate just painting the picture of, yeah. How to, how to balance all of. [00:46:00] Your venture experience permeating, yeah, as you said, your, your theater experience and informing the other, but any, if someone is, yeah, either looking to get into the theater business or start their own business, any last parting, parting shots advice?

Lorenzo Thione: Honestly, I think the single most important piece of any endeavor has always been my network. And so I, I, I say, I tell people like, and to your network and to it as if it were a garden, like find out how you can be of help and support, what is it that they need, just like your plants will need something.

And then, you know, it'll be able to kind of bloom and fruit and give you the fruits of it. But

Mikey Mioduski: yeah. The network. That's amazing. You heard it here. Presentation Nation. Well, Lorenzo, thank you so much. We will, we'll, uh, point links so that people can follow you. Yeah. Super helpful. We've learned a lot. We know our, our listeners will have as well.

So Molly, what do you say? Should [00:47:00] we, should we wrap

Molly Geoghegan: up? Yeah. Thanks so much for joining Lorenzo and everybody else in the meantime.

Lorenzo Thione: Right on. Thank you. All right. Keep on Pitchin Keep on Pitchin